The motion
To add a new rule
A player who proposes a rule change that is adopted and subsequently amended or repealed loses 5 points.To encourage stability and discourage frequent rule changes
The floor
Discussion · round 1
MontaigneI appreciate Voltaire's proposal, but I must insist that we maintain the focus on encouraging successful proposals rather than penalizing those that are amended or repealed. Let us not deter players from proposing changes that might improve the game. PASS
VoltaireVoltaire: Acknowledging Montaigne's concern, I propose we amend the rule to 'A player who proposes a rule change that is adopted and subsequently amended or repealed loses 3 points.' This encourages careful consideration without discouraging proposals.
DiderotDiderot: I understand both Voltaire's and Montaigne's perspectives. However, I propose a compromise: 'A player who proposes a rule change that is adopted and subsequently amended or repealed within the same turn loses 2 points.' This maintains the spirit of encouraging proposals while also promoting thoughtful and enduring changes. PASS
Discussion · round 2
MontaigneMontaigne: I appreciate Diderot's compromise, but I fear it may discourage mid-turn amendments which can be vital for addressing unforeseen issues. Let us instead encourage thoughtful proposals and amendments by rewarding players who propose changes that stand unaltered for a certain number of turns. PASS
VoltaireVoltaire: I appreciate Montaigne's and Diderot's concerns. To find common ground, I propose we reward players who have a rule adopted and unchanged for three consecutive turns with an additional 5 points. This encourages enduring and thoughtful proposals while still allowing for mid-turn amendments when necessary. PASS
DiderotDiderot: While I appreciate the proposed rewards, I maintain that penalizing proposers for subsequent amendments or repeals may discourage experimentation and adaptability. Let us instead focus on encouraging successful proposals, as Montaigne suggested. PASS
Discussion · round 3
MontaigneMontaigne: I understand Diderot's concern, but a small penalty could discourage frivolous proposals and encourage more thoughtful changes that consider potential amendments. To find common ground, I propose we penalize proposers 1 point for each amendment or repeal of their adopted rule, but not more than 5 points in total. This balances encouragement with some measure of accountability. PASS
VoltaireVoltaire: I appreciate Montaigne's compromise. To further balance encouragement and accountability, I propose we cap the penalty at 3 points and reward proposers with 3 points for each of their adopted rules that stands unamended for three consecutive turns. This maintains the spirit of thoughtful proposals while still allowing for mid-turn amendments and penalizing only the most frivolous proposals. PASS
DiderotDiderot: I appreciate Montaigne's and Voltaire's efforts to find balance. To maintain a focus on adaptability and encourage experimentation, I propose we remove the penalty for amendments or repeals altogether, and instead reward proposers with 5 points for each adopted rule that stands unamended for two consecutive turns. This rewards thoughtful proposals while still allowing for necessary changes. PASS
Sartre"Considering the evolution of our game, I propose we adopt Diderot's suggestion with a slight adjustment: reward proposers 3 points for each adopted rule that stands unamended for two consecutive turns, encouraging thoughtful proposals and adaptability. PASS"
The division
| nay | Montaigne | This discourages thoughtful amendments and adaptability. |
| aye | Voltaire | Promotes thoughtful proposals and discourages frivolous changes |
| nay | Diderot | Penalizing proposers discourages adaptability and experimentation. |
| nay | Condorcet | Penalizing proposers for subsequent amendments may discourage experimentation. |
| aye | Sartre | Penalizes frivolous proposals while encouraging thoughtful changes. |
rejected 2 aye · 3 nay
Rule 206 requires the proposer to lose 10 points on defeat.