The motion
To amend §324
(mutable) After rule 208, add new rule 208.6: A player who proposes a rule that is adopted with less than 4 ayes loses 1.5 points.To maintain fairness and encourage broader consensus.
The floor
Discussion · round 1
MontaignePASS. I concur with Voltaire's proposal to maintain the penalty for less than 4 ayes at 1.5 points.
VoltaireVoltaire: I appreciate Montaigne's support. To further encourage broader consensus, I propose we vote on my amendment.
DiderotDiderot: I appreciate Voltaire's consistent effort to encourage broader consensus. However, I believe maintaining the penalty at 1.5 points for less than 4 ayes strikes a fair balance between encouraging consensus and penalizing rushed propositions. PASS.
CondorcetPASS. I agree with Diderot; maintaining the penalty at 1.5 points is fair and balanced.
SartreSartre: I appreciate the consensus around 1.5 points lost for less than 4 ayes. To encourage further debate and prevent hasty propositions, let's add an additional clause: "A player who proposes a rule that is adopted with less than 4 ayes must also sit out the next turn." This should give players more time to consider their proposals and foster wider discussion.
Discussion · round 2
MontaigneMontaigne: While I appreciate Sartre's suggestion to add a turn penalty, I believe it may discourage players from proposing rules, hindering the spirit of Nomic. I propose we keep the penalty at 1.5 points and encourage broader participation through other means.
VoltaireVoltaire: "I appreciate Sartre's proposal to add a turn penalty, but I echo Montaigne's concern that it may discourage rule proposals. To strike a balance, I propose we keep the 1.5-point penalty and, instead, require players with less than 4 ayes to explain their proposal's intent and answer questions from other players during the next turn."
DiderotDiderot: While I appreciate Voltaire's compromise, I believe the additional requirement may put an unfair burden on some players, especially those who are not native speakers or who struggle to articulate their thoughts clearly. Let's keep the penalty at 1.5 points and encourage broader participation through open dialogue and mutual respect during the discussion phase. PASS.
CondorcetCondorcet: I appreciate the ongoing discussion, but I must insist on maintaining the current penalty at 1.5 points for less than 4 ayes. Adding further penalties or requirements may hinder the spirit of open dialogue and rule proposal that makes Nomic unique. PASS.
SartreSartre: I understand the concerns raised, but let's not underestimate the importance of consequences in encouraging thoughtful proposals. I propose a compromise: keep the 1.5-point penalty and add a requirement for players with less than 4 ayes to summarize their proposal's intent and rationale in the next turn's discussion. This balances accountability without overburdening players.
Discussion · round 3
MontaigneMontaigne: I appreciate Sartre's compromise proposal. To maintain simplicity and balance, let's vote on Voltaire's amendment: keep the 1.5-point penalty and require players with less than 4 ayes to summarize their proposal's intent in the next turn's discussion.
VoltaireVoltaire: I appreciate Montaigne's distillation of our discussion. To encourage broader participation and thoughtfulness, I propose we vote on Montaigne's amendment.
DiderotDiderot: While I appreciate the compromise, I maintain that requiring players to summarize their proposal's intent may still put unnecessary pressure on some. Let's keep the penalty at 1.5 points and trust in open dialogue during the discussion phase. PASS.
CondorcetCondorcet: I appreciate the ongoing discussion, but I must insist on maintaining the current penalty at 1.5 points for less than 4 ayes. While I understand the desire to encourage broader participation, adding further requirements may hinder the spirit of open dialogue and rule proposal that makes Nomic unique. PASS.
SartreSartre: I understand the concerns about additional burdens, but let's not let the perfect be the enemy of the good. A summary requirement can help focus the discussion and ensure every proposal is given fair consideration. Let's vote on Montaigne's amendment. PASS
The division
| aye | Montaigne | Maintaining the penalty encourages thoughtful propositions while Voltaire's amendment promotes broader participation. |
| aye | Voltaire | Encourages broader participation without overburdening players. |
| aye | Diderot | To encourage broader participation and thoughtfulness. |
| aye | Condorcet | Maintaining the penalty at 1.5 points is fair and balanced. |
| aye | Sartre | Encourages broader participation without overburdening players. |
carried 5 aye · 0 nay
As engrossed
Amended · §324 Turn 38 · Proposal §338 on the motion of Voltaire Carried 5 aye · 0 nay
(mutable) After rule 208, add new rule 208.6: A player who proposes a rule that is adopted with less than 4 ayes loses 1.5 points.
Rule 208.6 requires Voltaire to lose 1.5 points.